2024 Leadership Development Trends and Predictions - Tips, Tricks, and Preparation

Welcome to today's presentation. Uh, I'm gonna just caveat it with a giant asterisk. It's gonna be a little bit presentation, hopefully mostly discussion. Um, so let's jump into it. 2024, leadership Development Predictions. I think, uh, before we jump into our predictions, I just wanna say like, you have probably seen predictions all over the place, and predictions come with a grain of salt, right? Like it is, they are helpful in the how you use them to think about like, is my strategy kind of tracking? Am I getting any, uh, new information that I might wanna consider, uh, and what I am currently doing? But we can't really predict the future. I think, um, there have been some things that even happened in this last year that were like how much AI took over that. Like we maybe wouldn't have predicted completely, like the surge of that and what it might mean in everybody's day-to-day lives or jobs. So there will be things like that. But I'd love to hear from you throughout this entire presentation. I think Zach did a great job teeing that up. Um, if you are seeing like a different spin on something that we're saying or you have real experience with it, uh, and even tips and tricks to share amongst this group, this is really the space to do that. So let's jump in, uh, and we'll do like a quick intro of ourselves. I'm, uh, just gonna intro of myself. First. I'm Ellen Gomes. I, um, run a lot of marketing at Torch, but what that really means is I partner so deeply with, um, Mandy and our teams to create thought leadership that is, and research that provides valuable content. Um, and hopefully like how-tos to support people, uh, in your roles and also our customers as well. Um, we wanna be contributors and good stewards in this space. Uh, and previously I have worked with LinkedIn Learning and Clint, so, um, like love hr, the HR space, and the people that I get to work with here. Um, I also hold an MBA from San Jose State and I'm just really excited to have this conversation. I'm gonna pass it over to my esteemed and lovely colleague Mandy. So nice. Ellen, is my audio working? I decided to stop working for a brief minute. You're on. Yeah. Just to like get all of our heart rates up. Yeah, that's always really, really fun. Um, so as mentioned, Mandy Varley, I'm the principal behavioral scientist here at Torch. Little bit about me. Um, so I do have a PhD in organizational behavior, um, from Case Western Reserve University in Cleveland, Ohio. I saw there was some Ohio people there. Oh. Um, and you all know what to do in the chat. Um, so Case Western was a great place to do a PhD 'cause it's one of the only hubs of coaching research in the world. I love it. I, uh, thank you. Appreciate it. Um, so case you not only research executive coaching, they train coaches, they provide coaching. So I also was trained as an executive coach while I was at Case and have been practicing, um, coaching for a long period of time, probably about a decade now. Um, so really love the industry, done research on it, um, participate in it, particularly love group and team coaching. Those are like some of my faves. Um, as Zach mentioned, I have an MBA, so I kind of take all of this in, blend it together to be like, okay, coaching is a really useful l and D tool. People get a lot out of it, but at the same time, in order for it to be effective, it's a private conversation. So how do we show that it's adding value? So all of that nice complicated space. So, um, I really love talking about coaching in the benefits it does. And not only how it benefits individuals, also organizations. That's me. Excellent. All right, let's jump in. So question time. Let's pull up in the chat, uh, which of the 2024 predictions that you've seen either from us, from other places. I actually just read persons, I read threads, um, they're all over the place. Prolific amount of predictions, which prediction in 2024 is resonating with you. Um, or that you're really taking to heart in your strategy. Uh, and so like let's share with each other, um, in the chat right now. Um, look for some, yes. Also, let's connect with each other. I think all of us should. Um, so you can totally, I saw that Jennifer, uh, leadership development, ai. I'm just gonna read some as they come in so people can see. Um, manager training. We'll get into that a little bit today. Training. Training versus coaching. Yep. I think like some of these themes are feeling, uh, right spot on. And Mandy, I don't know if you have thoughts as you see them, like scrolling through, Uh, ooh. Burnout. I don't know if we'll get into burnout, but I have lots to say on that. So maybe we'll offroad at the end. Yeah, I know. I feel like I like live that wor world with like, uh, employee engagement too, right? Mm-Hmm mm-Hmm. So much to do with it. Alright. Mm-Hmm. I'm gonna move us forward and we can revisit these topics too towards the end. Keep populating it. Um, in here. So this is like a mega list and I will not read the entire thing to you because you can read and it will be long. So, uh, what I wanted to say is a lot of the themes that you're popping into the chat are, uh, showing up here, right? Is just like the importance of leadership intelligence, the ever-changing role that we're expect or, uh, skillset. We're expecting leaders to demonstrate the noisy landscape of learning tech, um, and just the environments that we're all having to operate in. I think, um, resource constrained is like a gentle kind way to say, uh, identify some of the stressors that I think like, uh, l and d and HR departments are under right now. Uh, and to, to tie with that is really just like the need to drive broader impact. So here's the like nice polished, perfect content version of the list that you will find in the asset that we created too. So if you want like a deep um, dive after the fact, you can either watch the recording or you can download our asset. But here is Mandy's take. So yeah, it sounds really beautiful, but I mean, I'm a coach. I teach people I've worked in universities, those sorts of things. Unless it's short, you're not gonna remember. So this is me taking our beautiful language and then shortening it into something that you can remember. Um, so basically like, again, leaders have to adapt or perish that is kind of a theme every year. And so it applies again in 2024. Um, skills may change number two, but how you get them doesn't, we actually know a lot about how people learn and change their behavior and that science isn't getting written over anytime soon. Um, if ever three CHROs, it's all about showing the money and the organizational impact for humans learn by doing. Um, and we'll get into that in a little bit more detail. Behavior change is the metric. I'm not just saying that 'cause I'm a behavioral scientist. I firmly believe that and we'll talk in a lot more detail about that as well. Um, upskill lift all boats and target the right boats go together. So if you heard a rising tide lifts all boats, that's on my mind a lot this year. 2024 is the year the manager and also the role of ai. So that is my translation, um, into short, punchy phrases of what's really going on behind these. Um, and we're not gonna talk about all of 'em today. Like Ellen said, there's an asset where we go into more detail. You can read about all the different nine. We're just gonna really talk about five today and that's plenty 'cause we also wanna talk to you. Alright, All right, let's jump in. So the first one we're gonna cover is really like upskilling to lift all boats. So when we think about l and d programs getting, uh, more focused in order to drive a broader impact on the organization, which like might sound like it's kind of at odds with each other, but, um, I think it's something I, and you can share in the chat, like if it resonates with you, but like when we go to some of even the Achieve events and we talk to people in the wild, not in virtual bubbles, right? Like this is a challenge that a lot of hr, um, and l and d leaders are facing, which is, hey, you're being asked to do either the same or more with less. Or maybe it's not volume of programs that you're being asked to do more of, but you're asked to drive more results. Um, and so how are you going to deliver what you need to in order to be successful and honestly in order for your organization to be successful? Because it's not just like, cool, I checked the box, right? Like, you are in this foundational role of enabling people to be really successful in their jobs and move the organization forward. And so there's real impact when you're having to be creative about how you're getting that done. And so I think this is probably just, um, feels a little bit like, yeah, duh, but it is good metrics. Um, and, and I love it. I think that some of this feels like what, um, many of us like just kind of intuitively know or believe, right? And so like there's data that will show you that backs up what I would say is your intuition or your experience. Um, and it's just that companies with great leadership development practices have better outcomes. And this is out of, uh, burson's most recent leadership development study. Uh, and so they have better business outcomes, they have better people outcomes, and they have better innovation outcomes. And so if you're looking for ways to kind of make your case or substantiate kind of your purpose, this is some good fodder for that. And we also have some research that I think, um, Mandy will cover later around like the ripple effect and the impact of really effective leadership development in an organization. All right. Oh, before I jump, I wanna just stop and say like, Hey Mandy, you got anything you wanted to add on that one? Let's, let's keep it moving. Keep that frame. Alright, keep it moving. Okay. So it lifts boats, but it also targets the right boats reference to the study. Yes. I will put in the links, um, after, we will send them after i, they are linked in the deck, so you'll get like a recording with the link. So I just wanted to address that. Um, so targeting the right votes and these resource constrained environments programs have to provide skill development at all levels of the organization. And actually I'm gonna pass this one to Mandy because it was her prediction. I think I'm gonna be right on the money with this one. Um, so it can sound counterintuitive to have programs that are supposed to lift all the boats and target the right boats, but those go together because there are certain places in the organization that you can target that is gonna have, um, an outsized impact if you invest your l and d, um, time, energy, effort, resources, money, all those good things. Um, so we can do next slide please. Beep Beep. Um, so we like to talk about this as kind of focused moments or moments that matter within, um, an employee's lifecycle. Within different times in your organization, you can actually zero in and be like, okay, this is actually a moment when someone could benefit from more l and d support. Um, I mean I always talk to coaching, you know, I'm a coach, the thing that I love talking about. Um, and so in particular providing coaching at moments when someone gets promoted and the scope of their role is changed and now there's new skills that they need to acquire and use quickly. Um, if layoffs is a big one, we've been hearing a lot about that. And so being able to support not only your people that are really stressed that now have to do more work that are maybe upset, but also oftentimes with layoffs you get a reorganization. So people are put into leadership positions and also have the um, the task of rebuilding trust among employees and in the organization and the leadership. Those are all difficult, tricky skills. Um, and so that's what we think about using coaching for. So those are a couple examples, but we have more assets that we can go into more detail. So I'm gonna drive us a little bit forward to really talk, um, a little bit more on the types of transformations that can come out of coaching. And so it's not just that you can see people's behavior change and you'll see me, you'll hear me talk about behavior change quite a bit, but it also has an impact, um, on the people around someone who goes through coaching. So when a manager goes through coaching, their direct reports not only see the manager behaving differently, they actually feel differently too. And so we did some great research, we've called it the ripple effect is probably one of my favorite research reports to date. Um, 'cause it was a really challenging thing to look at. So not only what are the changes of someone who goes through coaching, but what do people around them experience? And so we look particularly at managers in their direct reports and the direct reports of managers that received coaching. 94% of 'em in our study saw some sort of positive change in their manager as a result of coaching. And one of the big changes was really around communication skills. So not only someone's ability to communicate, but also like senior leaders asking better questions, explaining why they're making decisions. Um, a lot of richness comes out of that. Next slide please. All right. And then not only are, you know, direct reports seen the, their managers behaving differently, but that actually translates into changes for the direct report as well. And so, um, based on our results, 65% of our respondents said they can be more of themselves at work, 72%. So they feel safer offering their opinion and 64% feel that their contributions are valued more often. Those of you who are deeply familiar with the work of Amy Edmondson will recognize these as all relating to psychological safety. And so being able to speak up, be yourself, offer opinions, especially if no one else agrees and feeling valued are the key components of psychological safety. I'm sure I'm talking to, uh, a bunch of HR nerds. And so we all know about Google's project Aristotle where they looked at what is the secret sauce of a high functioning team. It largely boils down to psychological safety. And so this is a great outcome that you can see for, um, the whole team of someone who goes through coaching. So it's not just the person who gets coaching that benefits, it's their team as well. And one more call out for feeling like you can be yourself at work is a really good, um, it correlates very strongly with feeling like you belong, um, and that you are included. So which also relates to employee retention, like all those good things go together. Next slide please. Thank you. All right, so you already kind of heard me preview this slide a little bit that when managers team change, so does their team. And so some other ways, like aside from um, team members feeling more psychologically safe, they actually start to change their own skills. So you wouldn't think that a manager receiving coaching actually means that it upskills their employees, but it does. Um, the employees feel like they're more supported, that they're being coached by their manager more often to develop these sorts of skills. Um, they find it easier to coordinate with other people. Um, and even just like this emphasis that the manager starts to have on experiencing coaching starts to frame the idea of having a continuous learning culture and where it's great to notice what you're great at and what it is you wanna work on and spend time developing and changing. Anything to add here Ellen? Nope. Ru No, I just think like, I think, I mean in my own experience it's something that like maybe we felt was true like, uh mm-hmm, oh, if I see this and I feel it, then like I might emulate it. Like, hi, I'm a parent and like you can see, uh, I can set some boundaries and like talk all day long about what I would like my toddler to do, but what I model is actually what they're going to do and how they use like their tone of voice and manners and how they treat others. And to me, when I saw this data I was like, yes, that's so logical. But also there was just a total deficit of like any data proving this in the workplace. And I think, um, I just think like one ad that I have is like what we see is like challenges for people who either deeply believe in coaching or trying to like expand the footprint of their coaching program is like, oh, it's like such a select few, right? And so being able to come back and say like actually like, yes, you're only putting a certain amount of people like through a program or giving coaching to them. One, we don't have to like boil the ocean and have every single person get it. But also like that there is just this effect that does shift individual teams and like ultimately like the fabric of your organization if you're doing this in kind of the right pockets and in a focused way the way like Mandy started talking about it. But anyway, over to you Mandy. I like that. Thanks Ellen. Great add, I love the, uh, all the water. Uh, they're not puns but phrases we're talking about lifting tides, boiling oceans, all of these good things. Um, one thing just to touch on before we go to the next prediction is we found a duration effect and the data that we collected, which was really cool to see. 'cause we, I mean I frequently talk to people about like, well how long does someone need to be in coaching? Like, can't they get done in three months? And I mean three months is a really short period of time in which someone kind of takes in the idea of how they might wanna change their behavior at work and then starts doing it in a way that other people can notice. So generally, you know, we're thinking, well we know six months is effective, like people do noticeably change their behavior after six months of coaching. But then we found evidence that if you have more than six months of coaching, it actually ends up being more beneficial for the direct reports of that person receiving coaching and for the organization as a whole. And so this is looking at um, people that were in coaching for more than six months had a stronger ripple effect on their teams. And this is data where it like, it really counts if the direct reports are likely to stay at your organization, they're more committed to being there if they feel more psychologically safe, they have positive attitudes and they are um, more satisfied with their work overall. Like those are really key drivers of being able to retain those employees, upskill them so they become your leaders. And there's so many great payoffs. Um, and it was really interesting to see like, okay, the more, the longer you have to work with a coach and the more support you have in trying to make, um, changes to your behavior, the more it pays off. All right. Okay, this next one I think I saw show up in the chat at the beginning a lot and I, I'm gonna say like 20, 24 a year of the manager, but almost I'm a tongue in cheek because like when has it not been the year of the manager? Similar to like that there just are a lot of predictions is like, I think, and I wouldn't even say more and more I think organizations, um, but I know probably this group of people already knew this, like just the pivotal role that a manager plays in an organization, right? And so, um, recognizing that there isn't like the title of manager isn't like a monolith of a band of people that they have like different needs uh, depending on where they are in their like manager journey. And also just all of the expectations of an organization on a manager and how are we actually serving them versus kind of doing like same old same old status quo kind of programs because um, I would bet that you are currently running manager programs and I would love to ask the question and invite it into the chat like, what are you doing and of what you're doing, do you feel like it's effective or what is the most effective? Um, because I think that's really when we say you're of the manager, it's about putting our finger on the challenges and being able to like actually address those in a sustainable way, right? Instead of these like spurts of energy. Um, Mandy do you have something to add before I jump? It looked like you wanted to say something. Um, I love the Mary Poppins gif. Um, people have called me Mandy Poppins at different times in my life though that, I mean, as I have already said, like I totally said this when introduce that I have a toddler, we watch a lot of Mary Poppins in my house, but, and so the Mary Poppins bag feels like, um, very close to home. But I also do, the reason I chose this Giphy is because in so many ways we expect our managers to be Mary Poppins, like, oh, you just have this skill or this ability to just like pull this out of the hat. We're having layoffs. Like you're ready to handle those tough conversations, right? And continue with the organizational priorities, act as player and coach. Like if you just think about, and I just wrote a blog on this on the torch website, if you think about even just like the tech stack that a manager has, and the exercise I asked people to do was like, write down the tech stack that a manager interacts with on a day-to-day basis. And then go back to that post-it and circle any tech or tool that is solely there to like help them feel better or alleviate the burden of all the things they have to do. Good luck finding one. Like they're, they're not, it's hard like, and I just was even thinking about my own journey as a manager, like, you have to do this for financial processes, you need to do this for performance management. Like here are all your communication tools. You serve as this like linchpin in an organization. Um, and every year you're asked to be flexible based on like what's going on in the world. Like in the middle of Covid it was like, can you pivot really quickly to be remote? Then it's how can you serve a hybrid team? Um, right now, like everybody who I'm sure you can see like in the media, like on Wall Street Journal, et cetera, like there's a lot of heat on DEI is a function. One of the sub arguments and I think like a handful of red articles I read was, well this really should just be in the fabric of the organization and the manager should be doing this. It's like, okay, but is the manager equipped to do that? Um, and so when we say you're the manager is how are we gonna support these people really? Um, is a question I have. And so this is again, same Josh person article that I popped into the chat. Um, it has this full, uh, set of thinking and data, but if you just look at the top, uh, capabilities that we say matter most developing leaders and managers. But my challenge to that is are we doing it in the right way? Like I am not convinced. And so, uh, I know Mandy, you have some thoughts on this? I I do. Thank you. I have lots of thoughts and I've done a lot of reading about this too. Like one thing that I just wanna throw out because we're kind of talking about like how absurd the job of a manager is and that wasn't Ellen's language, that's mine. I'll own it. It's absurd. Um, there was a really interesting study that was done I think at the seventies where um, they had someone follow around a manager all day. This researcher was looking to be like, what is the job of manager? What is it? What are they doing? And he actually wrote down what he observed and he is like, I just saw this person running around talking to people all day. Like managers don't really do anything. And so it's interesting 'cause a lot of what a manager does that adds value is a a lot of times invisible. It's these conversations and it's the outcome of those conversations that really end up being important. And you need the right skills in those conversations to have the right impacts on the right outcomes. So that was on my mind 'cause I just, I always think about that, like what is it that managers are doing? They're doing so much, it's just really hard to see. Um, okay, so shifting a little bit more into like skills and challenges. Um, I mean if we're gonna talk about what's going on in the world in general, I mean there's a lot more economic uncertainty. Um, so not only managers feeling, um, potentially insecure in their jobs, but their direct reports feeling insecure in their jobs. And when you have job insecurity, stress goes up, people are more likely to churn. Um, but at the same time, like when we talk about workforce shrinking retention of employees, especially your top performers is really crucial. There used to be, we used to operate in a market where, I don't know that everyone was a top performer, but there was just more talent available to bring into your organization to do all different kinds of jobs. But we have, um, a declining birth rate in the US really across the globe. So there's actually just gonna be fewer people in general. Um, and not all of them will be top performing. So if you do have top performing talent, like holding onto them is really important. Um, and it can be a lot more challenging because your top performing talent has options. So if someone's gonna pick up and leave, it will be them. So holding onto them is, is really key. And one of the ways that you do that is through good management. Um, Gallup did a really interesting survey, um, some research on like skills that managers need and really like 90% of managers do not naturally have those skills. And when you think about like the path to becoming a manager, um, you are a great individual contributor and now you are asked to lead the team. Like this is cliche, we all know this. Um, but those are not the same skills. Like what got you to be the top IC is not gonna be what makes you a great manager, but in in some ways the skills, um, conflict with one another. So management is learned. Uh, I'd love that, love the conversation to just shift more and accept like you are acquiring a number of different skills. Um, and these skills take time and intentionality to get good at. Um, and so like when we, when we look kind of challenges versus skills manager, burnout is a really big challenge. Um, their jobs are ever increasing, they're complex. There's a lot of human to human elements and like sensitive topics and relational skills that you just need to be good at. Um, and so one of the ways that um, we've been thinking about at Torch how to support managers is looking at that stress management piece. And I don't mean like go take a yoga class 'cause really annoys me. People like, oh you're stressed, you should, you should do yoga and meditate. Um, it's thinking more fundamentally about like what gives you meaning in your life, what are your values? How do you fill your own cup before you pour to someone else? And how can you get some things off your plate that you might've done earlier in your career or feel like you need to do? Like is that a real story that you're telling yourself? Like can you give that over to your team? Um, and so those sorts of conversations are really beneficial in coaching. Um, I know I'm talking a lot about managers, this is so I'm like looking at the time like, do I have more time to say things about managers? You're good. I'll say a few more. I'll say a few more things about managers. Um, so I feel for managers, 'cause like there's the stuck in the middle piece, um, where you have to be a good advocate for your team and be willing to manage up so the expectations of those above you and also meet the expectations of those below you. So your direct reports. So you're providing different support and in two directions, um, as you're doing that job. And so I think kind of the, the main thing around that is self-awareness and that relates to the stress management piece. Like how do you come across to other people both above and below you, um, are you feeling like a certain degree of authenticity as you shift into this role? What is expected of you in the organization? Like what is your role? Because when you go into the peer reviewed research on like what managers do, it is not clear or evident. There's a lot of opinions on the skills that people need, but not a lot of very clear job descriptions. Um, and so being able to do a lot of sense making around that becomes super important. And then the last thing I'll say is about supporting direct reports. And this comes from um, there's like a couple of different pieces to this. Being able to coach and mentor your direct reports, taking a coaching approach using coaching skills is, is very valuable because the managers are actually the ones tasked with developing the um, that level within the organization. So whoever their direct reports are, oftentimes they, that group might be given training but it's unlikely that they would be given coaching. Um, although you could and I definitely love to talk about that, that would be really interesting. Um, but that's a level that you're usually relying on the manager to do the coaching and the skill development. And so making sure the managers have those skills is really key to make sure you're upskilling the talent that you have and getting them ready for those next levels. Um, to become managers themselves. Retaining those employees, especially if they're high performers. Um, and also just creating enough psychological safety in the team that they will share things with their manager that they need to know. As you increase in power within the organization, the less information that is shared with you because you have positional power. And so making it a space where direct reports feel like hey we can um, they can disclose that they see an error coming. Um, I'm trying to think of a non-super bleak example, but um, one of the ones in particular that I'm thinking of was the challenger disaster where someone saw that something was off in the calculations but didn't say something. Um, you see that with teams that are in medical fields. Um, nurses not having the same degree of power as doctors and so they don't say something even though they see something for fear of retribution. So psychological safety is important to like, um, avert major disasters and also to help your employees feel like they belong there, that they're included, um, that they're appreciated, all the good things that humans like, um, and make them feel engaged at work, what to stay with your organization, um, help you, help you move things forward. Yeah, lots of thoughts from me on managers. I'd also add like innovation, I think like, um, on the flip side of like the fear coin of like avert disaster, like there is the, if you have really great um, psychological safety then like the barrier or the risk of like presenting kind of an off the wall idea, which honestly like might change the course of your business and we could think of businesses where that's the case. Um, like you want that space where that creativity has like a soft landing and like safety to flourish. Um, I do have one example that I wanted to share and it, I think you mentioned to doctors and nurses a couple times, it's just like, um, managers look different uh, depending on every organization there is, like I was saying like no monolith of like what is a manager. Um, and we have a customer at uh, a top medical school that was really looking to use coaching, more formal coaching for uh, their top leaders because would it be to be a manager in those situations really was something that happened based on technical skill, right? And so, uh, what they didn't have was what we have been talking about which is a lot of the like relational skills. Um, and you know, fast forward they're a few months into their coaching process and the teams uh, and feedback of what it is like to go through coaching and what it feels like to be around each other going through coaching is just really positive. And I think um, there are a lot of industries where like coaching feels maybe like a one-off or like, oh I'm not totally sure how this applies or like, will this add value to my organization and would we unlock the ripple effect? And like what we've seen pretty much across industries is the answer is yes. Like coaching is so flexible and I think individualized and because there's the accountability over time, like that's where you really see like the results solidify into like changing uh, not the beha not just the behavior of the individual but behavior of everybody around them. Um, and it becomes kind of that, that culture shift. Uh, so yeah, I just wanted to share that. I think uh, we have another customer Zurich who did the same thing. So like back to the like not all managers are the same even within their organization. I was talking to our champion there, um, he was saying, you know, they would get their employee engagement results and what they would find, especially on like the manager based questions was people were happy, they were happy with their manager but it would totally depended on who their manager was. So they saw like basically like a lumpiness and skillset across their, a similar level of managers. And so they decided to pursue coaching kind of in two cohorts. Um, and they've seen like amazing results coming out of that. They piloted one group of this, one Sigma of this manager group and then moved on to do the second because the first was so successful and I know Mandy, you were part of that so you probably have like more color to add there. But I think like, um, they spoke, spoke with us at Gartner and just like the hearing their story about like how I think what it put its finger on for me is how pivotal a manager is to the experience of all of the employees around them on all of the things that Mandy was talking about, which is like retention and psychological safety and everything like that. And also like that this is an organization who looked at this as like hey this is a skills gap and how am I going to effectively address these skills because the things I'm doing aren't working anymore or they're not delivering what I wanted. I love that. I'm gonna call out one more thing that Ellen said and then we can move to the next prediction. Um, 'cause it's a little counterintuitive and it sounds so squishy. So I'm just gonna go ahead and say that like Ellen mentioned the um, people receiving coaching and those around them to be experiencing more positive emotions. The reason why I bring this up, like that's what we suspect really drives the ripple effect is the types of emotions that people are experiencing at work. And there's so many people out there who do not like to talk about emotions. Sounds really, ooh, like people I see people's faces go like what? Why are we talking about emotions? Um, emotions are contagious. There's a lot of really interesting research there that like whatever you bring with you, you share and spread whether or not you mean to and bad emotions are stronger than good emotions. So that's Roy Bell meister work, it's very fascinating and Barbara f Fredrickson added onto ro Bell masters's work to say like it takes a certain amount of positive things to overcome one negative thing. So there's still debate about what the exact ratio is, um, but Barbara Fredrickson stands by it being something like three to one. So for every one negative thing you need three good positive things to overcome it. And so that's a lot of dosing your organization with positivity when they're going through a difficult time versus kind of supporting people in a way that that negativity doesn't spread in the first place. Yeah. Alright, I'm gonna move us forward. Alright Mandy, this is your soapbox, meta learn by doing. Um, and I I'm gonna start and I'm gonna pass it over to you. It is just, uh, I think this is not news to this group, it's just the learning technology space has proliferated at this like wild pace. So this is a research, the learning tech report out of Red Thread, um, really recently, I think it was November is when it came out. Um, you can check them out on LinkedIn. Their research isn't always publicly available but you could slew their blogs. Um, but you can see in this chart like just a proliferation of learning technology. But does that mean we solved the problem? Like back to the like is it doing what it's supposed to do? And if you start with like your problem statement of what you wanna do with your people and how you wanna enable them, I don't think this proliferation has necessarily like cracked that nut or solved the problem, right? And so, and we know it hasn't because there are a lot of programs that are just running because of status quo and you think about like what is in a traditional l and d like tech stack and the programs that you're running as well. Uh, a lot of it is we do this because we've always done this or we do this because we get really great like employee NPS off of it. But if you look like just the retention of those knowledge of knowledge out of those different things like a virtual online learning course or even like, and I have been to these and love them like two-day management training, right? Like so energizing, did it change how I acted when I went back to my desk two weeks later? No. And that's so sad. Like it's not what we want to be true, but it is what's true. And so I think, um, just looking at the hard facts of like how noisy the space is and what your current and your current program mix and is it really delivering what you need it to? Um, and ultimately over to you Mandy, humans learn by doing So true. So there's um, both theoretical research and empirical research that backs this up. Um, one of the studies that I found really interesting actually compared all the different types of learning modalities that you could give to someone. So mentoring, um, job rotation, I know that's very popular. Uh, training and coaching and coaching was the most effective. It helping someone learn a new skill and implement it. So it's not enough just to like theoretically take in the information even though that's really enjoyable, like such a nerd here, love learning everything. But until I actually start to put that knowledge into practice, um, it's not a skill that I gained. It is a skill that I've heard about that I've thought about, I've cheated around in my brain but haven't actually been able to put into practice. And so that's where coaching is a different modality because you actually think about a skill, you learn it intellectually and then you start to practice it in the context in which you will use it. So it's not like a simulation where you're giving someone hard feedback. You are going to give someone hard feedback in the course of your job, evaluate yourself and talk to your coach about it and say like, Hey, I tried this. I'm not sure if this works. And get some other new ideas. You can do that one-on-one with a coach. Or you can do it in group coaching too actually where everyone kind of learns from everyone else on what's, what they're trying, what's going well, what's not working, all that good stuff. So, um, I mean I really like experiential learning nerds out there. Um, Dave Kob is a professor from Case Western, so I was very, very well steeped in the idea of not only, um, intellectually learning something but also doing it through practice. Um, so big fan of that. I think it's highly important. There's one more thing I wanted to say about experiential learning now I don't remember. So when we move on, I'm sure it will come to me. Uh, of course we got a great um, uh, quote from Troy in the comments, which is, practice is the difference be between knowledge and skill. Ooh, I loved it and I knew you would love it. Yeah. So thanks for participating there. All right, we're gonna only move us forward. All right, finally, behavior change. It's the metric. And I think like all of what we've talked about has led to this is like you can measure all of these different things, but at the end of the day, what are you trying to do? You are trying to get somebody to learn a new skill and in order for them to actually embody that skill, they have to change how they're going to act on a day-to-day basis in a situation. I remembered my thought. So Mandy, I remembered my thought. So I love this example. So it's like learning to ride a bike. Do you learn to ride a bike by watching a video on the internet or do you get out there on the bike and start messing around and seeing what, and sometimes you fall over, sometimes you're successful. Um, that's my favorite analogy 'cause it makes it really real like relational skills. Like you can't learn how to make someone trust you by watching a video on YouTube. You have to like start trying those behaviors out and seeing what happens. It's also really hard. And I would just to build on that example, like it's really hard to learn how to ride a bike without somebody encouraging you first showing you how, like when you fall saying like, that's okay, that happens. You hit a bump and that knocked you off your balance. Next time try accelerating a little bit before you hit the bump and you'll go through it more. Hi, I'm living this life right now. So it really resonates. Um, uh, but I think I think that that like to me highlights like the importance of a coach in that moment to help you like process digest and like build the resilience to power through that skill build instead of being like, that was hard. I can't do it. Or cementing like a bad habit. Mm-Hmm. I love it. All right, I'm gonna move forward. Here you go Mandy. Cool. Now one of my other favorite soapbox, um, and so I found this quote today that I think really applies, um, from Kristen Hannah. It's not intentions that matter, it is actions. So we are what we do and say not what we intend to do. And so I bring this up because um, sometimes there's a heavy emphasis of like, let's set some goals and work towards some things. And especially when we work with customers as we kick off a program, they're like, okay, so what is everyone doing? What's happening in coaching? Like we wanna see inside the black box. Like we know what goals they're setting. Like the proof isn't how people change their behavior. So everything else I think is like, eh, it's secondary, it's a nice indicator, but like it's not where I am emphasizing. And a lot of this, um, thinking comes from like the intention action gap. So we're in New Year's resolution season, I don't know if anyone set New Year's resolutions, if they're still on them. Good for you, you're in the minority because most people fall off New Year's resolutions because what it takes to achieve a goal, what it takes to achieve a resolution is actually changing your behavior not once, not twice, multiple times. And being consistent in that change. And so deciding which change you wanna stick with there, there's kind of an evaluation process, seeing what works, seeing what doesn't, that's where the experiential learning comes in. But it's this consistent behavior change that you're looking for. And so here is, this is, I made the slide, I'm not good at slides, so this one doesn't look that great, but the meaning behind it I think is very powerful. So when you're implying or when you're um, using coaching within your organization, what you're seeing is a bunch of individual people change their behavior in some way. And so because you can't mandate that humans change, especially not adults, you can try to mandate that kids change their behavior, but I also don't think that's particularly successful. People have to be inspired to change to do something different. And so it re requires um, a degree of autonomy. It requires relational support, but really getting people to think about like how could things be different and then get them to work toward it. So there is a lot of personal power behind these changes and as you see a bunch of people within your organization change their behavior, these changes ripple up through the organization. So it's not just that one manager is a better listener, another is good at giving feedback. Another is good at, um, listening. These all start to translate into different changes at the team group, department level where your teams are performing better, you're retraining the direct reports of different managers. Um, you're training your next line of folks to be, um, available to take those roles. And across the board you could say that there is um, like a revenue increase, but I think the stronger argument is really about cost savings. So I'm sure y'all are very familiar with the idea that retaining employee is cheaper than replacing them. It's the same thing with promoting employees from within. Um, you don't get that gap of someone, um, needing to onboard with your culture and understand how things are done around there. They can be more effective more quickly in a new role. And you also, um, generally when you hire from outside, I think the premium is something like 18%, um, of salary. So there's an 18% increase in salary when you look external versus internal. So all those really translate back to dollars and cents at the end of the day. Yep. All right. Here we are at the end and we would also like to take your questions. So one, I'd love to see like which prediction resonated the most with you of the ones we discussed today. And then also like any other questions, I know know we have a couple in the q and a, so I'm just gonna like poke over and see. Um, let's do, let's start with the first one, which is any suggestions as to how executives can creatively encourage employees along in their career paths by leveraging leadership coaching? Okay, so is that focusing? Could you repeat that one more time? Yeah, I know. I was like, lemme digest it. So it's basically like how can you leverage leadership coaching to encourage employees like career progression basically? Mm-Hmm. Okay. So I'm gonna interpret that basically as um, higher level leaders developing the skills that they need to effectively mentor those below them because I think that's a type of, when you're looking at um, more junior employees and career pathing and helping them understand what the options are available to them, um, you can use coaching for those younger employees to help them think about what they really want. But if they are missing the information about what is actually available, um, with in life in reality as opposed to a hypothetical, then mentorship ends up being a really good caring for them. And so I think at higher levels of your organization, you are trying to teach certain types of relational skills of which coaching is is one. Um, and if we're gonna break down coaching skills, we're talking about like listening, asking good questions, not being distracted and multitasking, but being very present in the moment, um, as something that you'd want your more senior leaders to do in order to effectively develop those below them. Yep, that makes a lot of sense to me. Cool. I'm gonna, I know we only have five minutes left so I wanna make sure we should get to as many questions as possible. Um, uh, one other question is, have you found value in tying coaching with a 360 prior to engaging? Which I know Mandy you have lots of thoughts on, we haven't talked a lot about like how does torch coaching typically work? But the answer short answer is yes and Mandy will cover more like, Uh, yes. So I think 360 are effective. I think they have a particular use. And so, um, we recommend that generally as part of a torch engagement. And the reason why you do a 360 is to help someone, um, build self-awareness. So it's one thing for me to assess how I'm doing on a number of different skills. I might think I'm an awesome listener. If you ask Ellen, she may or may not agree, I think she will agree because my self-awareness is very high. Um, and so what you're trying to do is help people understand how are you perceiving yourself, how are other people perceiving you? Are those in alignment? If they are, even if you're rating yourself low and everyone else rates you low on a scale that means you're self aware, like, you know, you're not great at that. And so it might be a thing that you work on or you might use one of your strengths to work on an area of weakness 'cause that's how you can make the most rapid progress with the type of skill that you don't currently possess. So I like three sixty's for that. The qualitative comments are generally the things that, um, are kind of the, the best thing to talk about with someone that you're coaching. So with people that I coach, we sit down and go through the qualitative comments where the qualitative comments align with the quantitative measures. Um, how does that align with who the leader wants to become in the future and what they're willing to work on. So it's a great tool with a lot of information that can lead to some really powerful coaching conversations and behavior change. Yep, that's great. Thank you. Um, okay, we have a couple minutes left. I'm gonna ask the last question that we got, which is, um, I'm a CEO with 13 directors. My operations manager seems burnt out and when I offer support, their response is always, oh no, I'm okay. Any ideas? Hmm, Hmm. Ooh, I love that there's a question about burnout. So I can understand there are a couple of different ways that you could be looking at this. So it could be, um, about someone's, the operations, manager's, personality, things that they value that they want to be of service and that that's where they derive a lot of personal satisfaction and value and think what they bring to the organization. Um, and so hearing that they're not providing that might be what's coming, like, Hey, do you need more support? Like, are you burnt out? I could see them being like, Ooh, I don't love how that's landing. And so if someone is coming across as burnt out, um, it might be helping them understand what it is they that you really need from them. There might be structural things at play, there might be things at play with that individual, um, how things are like coming from above in terms of like needing to execute different things might be landing with them, um, in a strange way. So there's a lot of different ways that you could go about it. I mean, I do love coaching as a gentle way to bring attention to things like that because it can be hard to hear that people think you're burnout because you automatically question your job performance. And also if we're gonna break down burnout, it is emotional exhaustion. Um, so you can't really control your emotions and process the emotions of other people. It's too much depersonalization. You start treating everyone else like an object, something that's in your way and like, I just need to get this done. So you have a task minded approach to anyone that you are interacting with as opposed to a relational approach. And then eventually it hits job performance and so you're actually seeing that perform person not perform as well. And so actually even asking someone if they're burnout can be a loaded question, but they can tell you how they want to be supported. Like that is true. Yeah, those are all really good tips. I think like, um, nobody has found the perfect silver bullet to burnout, but I do think, uh, coaching does help because of just like the individualized, personalized approach of it and, and that safe space, right, that is created around it. So, um, we, it's Fireproofing I think of, of coaching as fireproofing so that someone doesn't burn out Burnout. Yes, exactly. I love that term. Um, alright, well everyone, this has just been a delight for Mandy and I thank you for spending your time, uh, today with us. Uh, hope to connect with you, look for a recording of this and some follow on assets. If you have any questions for us, also after the fact, find us on LinkedIn. We're happy to touch base with you. But thanks so much for joining us and we hope wonderful day.

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